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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:56 pm 
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I know what's going on, cause I learned from Honor Harrington books.

So this is like the time that Baron High Ridge had to form a government with Countess New Kiev and Elaine Delacroix's "Liberals" eh?

:p

I never really understood why/how killing Pavel Young was a "beaching" offense. There should have been enough evidence, and whatnot to make the "duel" an OK thing.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:22 am 
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I'm currently reading/listening to War of Honor on audiobook, so...

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:07 am 
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Interestingly enough, I am also on that book on my current reread.

Also, High Ridge is a **** tool. They got played by Saint-Just.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 12:59 pm 
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Saint-Just plays everyone he comes across. Just as his model from the French Revolution did.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 1:51 pm 
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Never got that far... I tried reading it in 2012 or 2013 and got to "Honor Among Enemies" before deciding that the series was not getting any better, book-by-book; Weber was a hack and you could replace the name "Mary Sue" with "Honor Harrington" without needing to redefine anything.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:10 pm 
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^^ what she said

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:32 pm 
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Eh, Mary-Sue would apply if she never lost, and won handily every time.

That's not really the case. She loses throughout the series. Her "skills" are generally backed up for the most part.

She's no Bella Swan or Anastasia Steele ;)

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:14 pm 
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A lot of her Mary-Sue comes from the fact that Manticore is the technologically superior entity and the almost absurd level of professionalism in the Manticoran Navy.

She's actually tore up pretty bad by the midpoint of the series and she'd be retired or dead if not for Manticoran medicine.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:39 pm 
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Diamondeye wrote:
A lot of her Mary-Sue comes from the fact that Manticore is the technologically superior entity and the almost absurd level of professionalism in the Manticoran Navy.

She's actually tore up pretty bad by the midpoint of the series and she'd be retired or dead if not for Manticoran medicine.


Yeah. I agree here. The "Mary Sue" has more "informed" abilities for no reason. By "War of Honor" she's a decorated Full Admiral with *decades* of combat experience. Of course she's gonna be a badass.

The *only* thing I quibble on is her swordfighting ability in "Flag in Exile". I get that she's a "black belt" in the Coup, but that doesn't necessarily translate to kendo style swordfighting. Burdette was a master, but she took him like he wasn't even there.

Sues don't generally suffer at all, and they usually win pretty easily. She saved the Protector at dinner, because of Nimitz, and her unarmed ability... and STILL got shot in the face, losing her eye.

Escaping from the Peeps, she lost that eye again, and an arm. Spent all of "In Enemy Hands" without it. She has lost friends, family, colleagues, mentors, etc.

I have a hard time thinking of her a sa Sue.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 2:48 pm 
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Müs wrote:
The *only* thing I quibble on is her swordfighting ability in "Flag in Exile". I get that she's a "black belt" in the Coup, but that doesn't necessarily translate to kendo style swordfighting. Burdette was a master, but she took him like he wasn't even there.


IIRC the cybernetic eye had something to do with that as well, and that dual she won in the book before it. It was kind of weak, but it at least was a reason.

I didn't really like either of those books all that much though. They felt like a long lead-in to "Honor Among Enemies", as if he really wanted to write about q-ships and needed 2 books to justify putting Honor in charge of the squadron.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 23, 2017 9:41 am 
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The duel with Summervale made a bit more sense, she shot his *** from the hip.

I still am unclear on why killing Young "ended her career" though.

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